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New profiles.

After reading the new profile cards for the upcoming new rules set I noticed a few little things that struck me as odd. Firstly the faith ki feat on the rice farmers reads target peasant rather than target monk. Please tell me that this is just an error. Paying two ki to reduce the cost of a peasants ki feats by one ki seems a bit silly. Also has Tsutsumi lost his immunity to blindness? I know that it is a silly little thing that hardly ever has an in game effect but I like it for themeyness.

I must say that on the whole I really like most of the changes to the temple and I'm looking forward to playing with them.

GCT Master Enos's picture
GCT Master Enos
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Joined: 05/10/2012

Faith on Monks kind of had to go.

It was a limiting factor "Monks can't have X because with Faith they will...etc..." but was almsot never actually an issue as they weren't in the same theme so never interacted.

Now its for peasants, its getting used but I agree I'll look at the cost.

 

Tsutsumi, look at the change to Sixth Sense ;)

Grand Master of Bushido (Smog Con '14)

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That's a shame. I really liked the way the rice farmers supported the monks. It made them great support models. And in my opinion made running a generic list a really viable option.

What sort of abilities did they prevent the monks from having?

Ret-A_Palmer's picture
Ret-A_Palmer
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Joined: 15/05/2013

Anything with a variable value was hard to give to monks because of Faith.  It really messed with the early prototype of Risen Sun when ALL additional dice were added to the roll.

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The first thing I did after looking at the top 4 monks in temple was go and see if Rice Farmers still had Believer (monk). I was both a little disappointed and a lot relieved to see they didn't. I agree with the retainers and devs that it would have been game breaking considering how easy it is for Rokan to share ki and how many dice can be guaranteed +1s in a melee now thanks to kata and adept melee. Being able to boost MS for 1ki and gain unblockable for 2ki you are basically gaining unblockable and brutal 2 for Po's 3ki, without much risk of Master Po taking damage (who would risk not putting all in defence?) and could probably do this every turn if you have Master Ekusa in the list as well, spinning a ki out to the farmer each turn. Master Akari/Enos in contact with a couple of air elementals in the start phase could boost move to 8 turn one for 2ki if able to pull off Believer (Monk) giving an insane light footed 12" single run move and still leaving enough ki for a dash at the end of you wanted to reposition. The options for abuse of boosts would have made the Rokan very difficult to balance. A lot of this was possible before, but there wasn't the option of adept melee (1/2) and kata before, which makes the monks much more stable and effective so being able to boost to 8 melee for 4ki would be too much.

Also I love that Master Ekusa can actually use cavalry to engage opponents now instead of having to gain a move value from somewhere. Makes him much more useful and much simpler to use in the starter set.

The only negative I can see so far is that Akari seems quite expensive for his rice cost, when compared to Masters Po and Enos and without kata is very vulnerable on 1s when exhausted. I know that having parry 2 is very good, but only if you don't roll 1s, and Po can gain this through adept and all out defence for a single 2 ki MS boost as well as impenetrable defence of he has the ki. I guess I'll have to try Akari out but currently with how weak he is (4hp and very low dmg output) he is difficult to justify versus the cloud walking Master Po who can comfortably tank or output massive damage. At such a high rice cost it isn't worth considering taking both when Master Ekusa is such a powerful figure for less rice and Master Enos fulfils a similar role with the added benefit of being able to just outright remove a troubling model from the game. It's a bit of a shame because I love the model and concept of Master Akari and would like to be more tempted into taking him to a tournament again.

Axiam

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My primary concern with the change to the rice farmers is the reduction in mobility that the faith ability provided. I used faith primarily to boost the movement of the monks in order to pull bait and switch tactics or to create what we call an overlap in rugby to overwhelm a particular area of the board. Without their manouverabilty the monks are easy prey for samurai who can fight better on a per points basis (the Ito can outmanouver us now as well) or against horde type lists that can bog them down and beat them once they bring their superior numbers to bear. Even with their improved melee abilities I have serious doubts that they can win a battle of attrition. With their mobility curtailed they will be easier to pin down in combat.

Like the Tengu the Temple have been slated as a faction that relies on movement and positioning to win rather than raw hitting power. Now that the Ito have a base movement of 5 (albeit at the cost of a hit point reduction) as well as being able to boost their movement with many models I fear that the Temple will be outclassed both in terms of combat power and movement.

I agree with axiam about master Akari. He is still a superlative vim but in reality there are very few scenarios where you will get to choose your own vim. He can defend himself better than any model in the game but I think he will be very prone to being tied up by lesser value models that he simply can't kill giving your opponent a points advantage elsewhere on the table. I think that his primary problem is his lack of damage output. He was never the greatest choice in the previous edition and although his defence has been increased making him weak on top of his - 2 strength means that he will really struggle to find a position on a competitive roster.

I also agree that being able to engage with master Ekusa is a huge improvement.

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I can assure you that after multiple PT games with my monks against my friend's Ito that they are from from outclassed by the snakes (I think I might have lost one).

Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints.

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